CPU questions. (Dedicated Server Performance)

Discussion in 'Performance Tweaking' started by slayr288, Apr 19, 2013.

  1. Hey,

    I just need to know a few quick answers.
    I was looking at OVH's amazing prices on dedicated servers, and was wondering what I should get.

    You can find the packages here: http://www.ovh.com/us/dedicated-servers/

    So, I was wondering if the 'KS 1' could hold <enter your estimate here> players on 1 server with ~50 plugins, and if not, could the 'SP 1' hold the same server but with <enter your estimate here> slots.

    Finally, could the 'SP 3' hold 2 servers both @ <estimate your number here> slots?
     
  2. Honestly there are so many factors, 1) Plugin list 2) How many worlds 3) other things running.
     
  3. As the incredibly hard named person above said (no offense, just me laughing xD) there's a ton of different factors... I usually stick to the rule 10 players/GB of RAM, so I have a idea of how much RAM I'd need to allocate.
     
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  4. As RAM is important, it is not your most important factor. CPU Clock Speed is actually more important. At this point in time, Minecraft is still not Multithreaded, therefore, more cores != more power. We have the MG4, and it is amazing. If you were to do the SP series, (Dependent of player numbers and what not), You should go with SP3, for best performance. Best clock speeds, and it has SSD drives, which make more of a difference than you would think.
     
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  5. Thank you for the information.
    I was also thinking of getting http://www.hetzner.de/en/hosting/produkte_rootserver/ex4
    It is $65 a month, with a $65 setup fee. The CPU is an i7-2600, which clocks @ 3.4 Ghz normally and can go up to 3.8 Ghz with Intel's Turbo function.
    The disks are not SSD's but are 2 HDD's @ 7200 RPM in a RAID-1 array. (Would Minecraft ever bottleneck with that HDD set-up before a CPU/RAM bottleneck?)
    I have also heard that hetzner is a great hosting company.

    My only concern is that the German location would cause too high of a ping for my majority of players located in the United States, would that happen?

    Thank you for your time.
     
  6. A Bottleneck is when your home GPU over processes your CPU. xD

    As for ping, there may be some issues, but with Fiber Optics Networking, ping is slowly dissipating.
     
  7. Isn't a bottleneck when a piece of hardware is slower than any other piece of hardware?
    Anyways, I'm stuck between OVH's SP1 and Hetzners EX4.
     
  8. Meh, True. But with servers, that is extremely rare to happen between CPU, RAM, and HDDs.

    And Hetzner's is more expensive, though it does have 2 extra TB of storage.
     
  9. But for a Minecraft server, it's unlikely that anyone is ever going to use that much space.

    slayr288, if I was you, I would choose the SP1 plan from OVH. It's cheaper and better for your players (since you mentioned that most of your playerbase is from the US).
     
    #9 EncryptedCurse, Apr 23, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2013
  10. I would go with OVH if I were you. Yes, ping does matter, and I ping'd Hetzner's servers from my home, in Ohio USA and got a 132. To me, this is too high.

    Also, Hard drives are a bottleneck. Especially 7,200k RPM standard mechanical drives, and most of these hosters use for these(lower cost) dedicated servers. Throw a couple of MC servers, a SQL database, webserver for Dynmap, and periodic backups at your standard drives and you will hit quite an annoying wall.

    Myself, I had to add a couple of SSD's to host different applications/servers on, as access time on mechanical drives was annoying me.
     
  11. I'm going to address a couple false statements in this thread.

    1. Worlds are a big factor in server performance.
    My server currently has 65 worlds. It's not how many you have, it's how you set it up.

    2. CPU clock speed is the biggest factor.
    Clock speed isn't everything, CPU architecture can make a BIG difference. As a general rule, newer architectures will be better than older ones. My 3.4GHz Intel E3-1245v2 greatly out competes my 3.2GHz AMD Phenom II 840, despite there only being a 200mhz difference.

    3. Bottlenecks are rare on Minecraft servers.
    Completely false. If you start with shitty CPU like I did, you'll get a bottleneck there first. However, at around the 60 player mark, I hit a hard limit with HDDs. After I switched to an SSD, my server could go up to 100 people before it once again hit a CPU bottleneck. Now that I've upgraded my CPU and have an SSD, I have yet to experience any bottlenecks.
     
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  12. I think in my most humble opinion that you are wrong in a few places.

    1. How worlds effect performance depends on the size of the worlds, and how spread the users are plus which plugins you are running. I'm curious how you have setup your stuff in such a special way?
    I can't see that many different ways to do it, which would effect performance.

    2.Just for the record, comparing GHz between AMD and Intel like that is not possible. They count GHz differently.
    You have to compare within the same manufacturer, Intel vs Intel and also same class as the number of cores and HT and other options will make a difference.

    The most accurate source I've found to CPU performance for Minecraft is this;
    http://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html

    Where you see a score for Single Threaded Operations, the higher the better. You can compare various models of Intel and AMD Processors there. Though note that it's mostly "default" numbers, and does not include overclocked CPU's.

    To give you a comparison,
    Intel Xeon E3-1245 V2 : 1995 Points
    AMD Phenom II X4 840T : 1014 points

    The Intel CPU as you clearly states is superior to the AMD Processor, about 200% better.

    But something else that's interesting to look at is overclocking capabilities. As it has been stated before, Intel Core i7-3770K @ 3.50GHz can easily be overclocked to 4.7 GHz with just Air/Fan Cooling. I think I'll get mine to over 5GHz with just air.

    3. Bottlenecks are not rare. There will ALWAYS be bottlenecks in a system, one or the other component will always be the limiting factor of a computer, the question is just how soon you hit one.
    And it all depends on lots of factors.

    - CPU will be the bottleneck when it can't do enough calculations per tick. Which is affected by factors like, number of players, number of enteties (mobs/items/etc) and how well or bad coded your plugins are.

    - RAM will be the bottleneck when it can't hold enough resources in RAM and has to swap to HDD or just runs out of RAM. Also, the speed on the RAM can effect performance. Once again, this depends on the number of players and plugins. The more things to keep in memory, the more RAM is used. A map where users are clustered together will need less RAM because fewer chunks are loaded into RAM, compared to a map where few users are spread out a lot and each users has loaded chunks. RAM Speed and latency is really important if you consider overclocking.

    - HDD depends on the speed on the HDD, and type. An older "normal" HDD will be able to provide everything between 30mb-110/sec but the major problem is seek times and that you fast get disk queues when several read and/or write operations need to happen at the same time which happens when lots of players move on the map and need to load chunks into memory. The make and model of SSD disks also matter a lot, as the SSD Speeds varies from about 200mb/sec to 550mb/sec depending on the chipset.
    Splitting worlds/servers over several SSD's (don't use parity as it will usually decrease performance (extra data to write) and use SSD's designed for being used in a raid config) or use a RAM disk will give the best performance.

    - Internet Speed will also effect the number of players and lag. Factors that make a difference here is for example ViewDistance but also routing and indirectly latency which is something that's very hard (mostly impossible) to control.

    You can do your best to raise the bar and mitigate these bottlenecks as much as possible, but you will eventually hit them, one or the other. That's the law of physics.
     
    #12 spawnstah, Apr 23, 2013
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2013
    • Informative Informative x 1
  13. Yes, I believe you are correct. I knew this information, but my knowledge on how Minecraft consumes resources is limited.

    So, I have a few more questions:
    #1: Which provider provides better support/policies? OVH or Hetzner?
    #2: When will Minecraft be bottlenecked by a 7200 RPM HDDs in RAID 0?
     
  14. jtaylor69

    jtaylor69 Retired Moderator
    Retired

    My OVH server's usage (attached), with 8 servers running and a BungeeCord instance. 30-40 plugins average on each server.
    Also running CPanel, a few websites, Multicraft, GNOME (as seen in the screenshot) and Google Chrome.
    No lag on the server at all.

    I am using the SP 32G package, also recommended by EncryptedCurse.
    It has SSDs included.
     

    Attached Files:

  15. Mostly by only handling the worlds on demand, rather than having them always loaded.
    No they do not. A GHz is a GHz. It is one billion cycles per second. That is the definition of a GHz, you can't change it. What you're talking about directly backs up my point of the architecture of the CPU being a huge factor. AMD and In
    That's what I just said..
     
  16. Is that hardware or software RAID? If it's software, what CPU would you be using?
     
  17. A GHz is a GHz, right, but they do things differently under the hood, in the CPU. So you can't compare a Intel 4GHz CPU with a AMD 4GHz CPU. They both said years ago that they stopped this "highest possible GHz war" years ago.

     
  18. Which is EXACTLY why he tried to explain to you, that it's tthe architexture that's important...
    Duh...
     
  19. md_5

    Administrator Developer

    Over clocking to more than 4.5 on a server is crazy
     
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  20. Software, and an Intel I5-3570S.